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moderated Want a new sub-group? Reply here

 

Hi everyone! Thanks for joining.

apple-dev is intended to be a replacement for all the @lists.apple.com lists, of which there are/were many. Creating new sub-groups on groups.io is easy, but rather than make 100 of them up front, I just created the main two that I myself use (cocoa and xcode) and will create others on demand. So please reply on this thread if there’s a list you’d like.

(They don’t have to be replacements of the old lists, either. Apple seems to have stopped creating lists years ago. So for example I could see a demand for a game development list focused on SpriteKit, SceneKit, etc.)

—Jens

 

I had some requests via private email to create lists for the Objective-C and AppleScript languages, so I’ve made:
https://apple-dev.groups.io/g/objc
https://apple-dev.groups.io/g/applescript

—Jens

Dana Cartwright
 

RE: New lists

For those of us still working in Carbon, it's nice to have a place to ask questions.

But it's also very low volume, and probably a lot of us are porting legacy apps to Cocoa, so I'm torn between having a separate group, or just asking Carbon questions in the Cocaa list, as many questions will be of the form "How do I translate this Carbon feature to Cocoa".

- Dana Cartwright

On Jun 7, 2017, at 1:18 PM, Jens Alfke <@snej> wrote:
Hi everyone! Thanks for joining.

apple-dev is intended to be a replacement for all the @lists.apple.com lists, of which there are/were many. Creating new sub-groups on groups.io is easy, but rather than make 100 of them up front, I just created the main two that I myself use (cocoa and xcode) and will create others on demand. So please reply on this thread if there’s a list you’d like.

(They don’t have to be replacements of the old lists, either. Apple seems to have stopped creating lists years ago. So for example I could see a demand for a game development list focused on SpriteKit, SceneKit, etc.)

—Jens

 


On Jun 7, 2017, at 10:32 AM, Dana Cartwright <dana@...> wrote:

But it's also very low volume, and probably a lot of us are porting legacy apps to Cocoa, so I'm torn between having a separate group, or just asking Carbon questions in the Cocaa list, as many questions will be of the form "How do I translate this Carbon feature to Cocoa".

Sounds like just using the cocoa list would be better, since it would make such questions more likely to reach someone who knows the answer.
If there end up being a significant number of posts about Carbon itself, it’s no problem to set up a list for it.

—Jens

Mike Crawford
 

I'd like a drivers list. Apple calls theirs darwin-drivers.

They also have a usb list but they are both very low volume. For now
we should have just the driver's list, with usb being on-topic there.

Mike
Mike Crawford, Baritone
mdcrawford@...

One Must Not Trifle With Wizards For It Makes Us Soggy And Hard To Light.

On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 10:39 AM, Jens Alfke <@snej> wrote:
I had some requests via private email to create lists for the Objective-C and AppleScript languages, so I’ve made:
https://apple-dev.groups.io/g/objc
https://apple-dev.groups.io/g/applescript

—Jens

 


On Jun 7, 2017, at 2:44 PM, Mike Crawford <mdcrawford@...> wrote:

I'd like a drivers list.  Apple calls theirs darwin-drivers.

They also have a usb list but they are both very low volume.  For now
we should have just the driver's list, with usb being on-topic there.


—Jens

Jeremy Hughes
 

Can we have a Swift group?

Jeremy

--

On 7 Jun 2017, at 18:39, Jens Alfke <@snej> wrote:

I had some requests via private email to create lists for the Objective-C and AppleScript languages, so I’ve made:
https://apple-dev.groups.io/g/objc
https://apple-dev.groups.io/g/applescript

—Jens

 


On Jun 7, 2017, at 1:56 PM, Jeremy Hughes <moon.rabbit@...> wrote:

Can we have a Swift group?

Several groups for the Swift language already exist: https://swift.org/community/#mailing-lists

—Jens

Jeremy Hughes
 

Those lists seem to be run by Apple - are they (especially swift-users) not also threatened by the mailing-list cull?

I’m confused about what is happening. As far as I know, the only list whose closure has been announced is xcode-users. Are Apple closing down all their mailing lists, or just xcode-users?

Jeremy

--

On 8 Jun 2017, at 00:35, Jens Alfke <@snej> wrote:


On Jun 7, 2017, at 1:56 PM, Jeremy Hughes <moon.rabbit@...> wrote:

Can we have a Swift group?
Several groups for the Swift language already exist: https://swift.org/community/#mailing-lists

—Jens

Takaaki Naganoya
 

On the end of this January, Apple mailing lists halted. So we had contact with Apple people. They did not understand or make action to recover MLs. They did not understand what happened. It took about 2 weeks to recover MLs.

So, most of us had an anxiety about Apple employee’s intelligence and operability.

We needed backup plan to communicate with. This ML seemed a good backup.


--
Takaaki Naganoya
maro@...
http://piyocast.com/as/

2017/06/08 18:25、Jeremy Hughes <moon.rabbit@...>のメール:

Those lists seem to be run by Apple - are they (especially swift-users) not also threatened by the mailing-list cull?

I’m confused about what is happening. As far as I know, the only list whose closure has been announced is xcode-users. Are Apple closing down all their mailing lists, or just xcode-users?

Jeremy

--

On 8 Jun 2017, at 00:35, Jens Alfke <@snej> wrote:


On Jun 7, 2017, at 1:56 PM, Jeremy Hughes <moon.rabbit@...> wrote:

Can we have a Swift group?
Several groups for the Swift language already exist: https://swift.org/community/#mailing-lists

—Jens


2551phil
 

On 8 Jun 2017, at 16:25, Jeremy Hughes <moon.rabbit@...> wrote:
the only list whose closure has been announced is xcode-users.

It does seem weird that they would cull the xcode-users group alone.

I can only imagine that they’re waiting to get back from WWDC before pulling the plug out of that whole rusty server in the basement.


Best


Phil@sqwarq

 

On Jun 8, 2017, at 2:25 AM, Jeremy Hughes <moon.rabbit@...> wrote:

Those lists seem to be run by Apple - are they (especially swift-users) not also threatened by the mailing-list cull?
They’re run by the Swift open-source project, and they’re pretty high-priority as they’re the main way that people communicate, including the developers of Swift. Whereas lists.apple.com has been pretty much ignored by Apple for … at least five years? With periodic near-death experiences.

I’m confused about what is happening. As far as I know, the only list whose closure has been announced is xcode-users. Are Apple closing down all their mailing lists, or just xcode-users?
Only xcode-users as far as I know, but it wouldn’t make sense for them to close one list but not the others. It may just be that xcode-users is the only one where an Apple person decided to let the members know what’s going to happen.

Anyway, those lists have been on life support for years, and the listserv software they run is ancient. Groups.io has easily browsable archives, web forum access, wikis, calendars, and all the bells and whistles you could want. It seems like a much better home.

—Jens

Luther Baker
 

Would you mind creating something for Core Audio and Core MIDI?

Maybe something akin to 

coreaudio-api@...


Thanks,
-Luther

 

On Jul 4, 2017, at 9:49 PM, lutherbaker@... wrote:

Would you mind creating something for Core Audio and Core MIDI?
Sure, that sounds like a great idea, especially as I occasionally do audio coding myself.

What about higher level APIs like AVFoundation? Do you think those should be on-topic for this list too, or should there be a separate list?

—Jens

Luther Baker
 

I've been on that list for a bit now and from what I can see, discussions cover a pretty wide range. It is a specialty topic and I think the audience would largely be the same for the various possible lists.

That said, if other related lists exist on lists.apple.com, I'd be all for mirroring the same structure so as to minimize confusion. I'm just not aware of another such list.

Also, that list doesn't get pounded so I think you'd be safe starting with coreaudio-api and waiting for someone "in the know" to ask for more granularity.

Hope that helps,
-Luther




On Wed, Jul 5, 2017 at 12:17 PM, Jens Alfke <jens@...> wrote:

> On Jul 4, 2017, at 9:49 PM, lutherbaker@... wrote:
>
> Would you mind creating something for Core Audio and Core MIDI?

Sure, that sounds like a great idea, especially as I occasionally do audio coding myself.

What about higher level APIs like AVFoundation? Do you think those should be on-topic for this list too, or should there be a separate list?

—Jens


James Walker
 

On 7/5/2017 11:19 AM, Luther Baker wrote:
I've been on that list for a bit now and from what I can see, discussions cover a pretty wide range. It is a specialty topic and I think the audience would largely be the same for the various possible lists.

That said, if other related lists exist on lists.apple.com, I'd be all for mirroring the same structure so as to minimize confusion. I'm just not aware of another such list.

Also, that list doesn't get pounded so I think you'd be safe starting with coreaudio-api and waiting for someone "in the know" to ask for more granularity.

Regarding mirroring the structure:  Apple has a "QuickTime-API" list, which lately has had a fair amount of discussion of AV Foundation.  Maybe just add a "video" list?



On Wed, Jul 5, 2017 at 12:17 PM, Jens Alfke <jens@...> wrote:

> On Jul 4, 2017, at 9:49 PM, lutherbaker@... wrote:
>
> Would you mind creating something for Core Audio and Core MIDI?

Sure, that sounds like a great idea, especially as I occasionally do audio coding myself.

What about higher level APIs like AVFoundation? Do you think those should be on-topic for this list too, or should there be a separate list?

—Jens



Chris Ridd
 

On 5 Jul 2017, at 20:06, James Walker <jamesw@...> wrote:

On 7/5/2017 11:19 AM, Luther Baker wrote:
I've been on that list for a bit now and from what I can see, discussions cover a pretty wide range. It is a specialty topic and I think the audience would largely be the same for the various possible lists.

That said, if other related lists exist on lists.apple.com, I'd be all for mirroring the same structure so as to minimize confusion. I'm just not aware of another such list.

Also, that list doesn't get pounded so I think you'd be safe starting with coreaudio-api and waiting for someone "in the know" to ask for more granularity.
Regarding mirroring the structure: Apple has a "QuickTime-API" list, which lately has had a fair amount of discussion of AV Foundation. Maybe just add a "video" list?
Some of Apple’s lists have odd names that are quite hard to figure out without grokking a lot of history. e.g. the apple-cdsa list.

I’d vote for list names as generic as possible. So audio, video, security, etc. Or audio-api etc if you think it’d help.

Chris

Luther Baker
 

I'm not sure how far down this hole you'll want to go but here's a relatively complete list of mailing lists ... and yes, I'd agree with simpler names and potentially combining some of the groups.


-Luther


On Wed, Jul 5, 2017 at 3:47 PM, Chris Ridd <chrisridd@...> wrote:

> On 5 Jul 2017, at 20:06, James Walker <jamesw@...> wrote:
>
> On 7/5/2017 11:19 AM, Luther Baker wrote:
>> I've been on that list for a bit now and from what I can see, discussions cover a pretty wide range. It is a specialty topic and I think the audience would largely be the same for the various possible lists.
>>
>> That said, if other related lists exist on lists.apple.com, I'd be all for mirroring the same structure so as to minimize confusion. I'm just not aware of another such list.
>>
>> Also, that list doesn't get pounded so I think you'd be safe starting with coreaudio-api and waiting for someone "in the know" to ask for more granularity.
>
> Regarding mirroring the structure:  Apple has a "QuickTime-API" list, which lately has had a fair amount of discussion of AV Foundation.  Maybe just add a "video" list?

Some of Apple’s lists have odd names that are quite hard to figure out without grokking a lot of history. e.g. the apple-cdsa list.

I’d vote for list names as generic as possible. So audio, video, security, etc. Or audio-api etc if you think it’d help.

Chris


IgorD
 

But it's also very low volume...
On the other hand, it's easier to fand something when everything is relevant and without unrelated topics.

If there are more than a dozen people, maybe we should have a separate carbon topic.

igor

Ann K. Blombach
 

I vote for having a separate carbon sub-group. There may not be many of us, but the latest discussion shows there's still interest in carbon, and it's great to have a specific place we can go to for help and/or consolation.

Also, since it's quite possible some of the carbon folks haven't stumbled across the info about apple-dev.groups.io, I'm posting this to the Apple Carbon group as well. The more people who know that Apple is discontinuing their discussion lists, the better.

Ann

-----Original Message-----
From: main@apple-dev.groups.io [mailto:main@apple-dev.groups.io] On Behalf Of IgorD via Groups.Io
Sent: Friday, July 7, 2017 7:35 AM
To: main@apple-dev.groups.io
Subject: Re: [apple-dev] Want a new sub-group? Reply here

But it's also very low volume...
On the other hand, it's easier to fand something when everything is relevant and without unrelated topics.

If there are more than a dozen people, maybe we should have a separate carbon topic.

igor